It’s remarkable, considering the tone of so many Christian sermons and messages, that any church has honest people show up at all. I can’t imagine that any religion in the history of humanity has made as many clearly false claims and promises as evangelical Christians in their quest to say that Jesus makes us better people right now. With their constant promises of joy, power, contentment, healing, prosperity, purpose, better relationships, successful parenting and freedom from every kind of oppression and affliction, I wonder why more Christians aren’t either being sued by the rest of humanity for lying or hauled off to a psych ward to be examined for serious delusions.It's a good read, but if you're a "good christian," as Imonk says, you might want to "go do something else."
Evangelicals love a testimony of how screwed up I USED to be. They aren’t interested in how screwed up I am NOW. But the fact is, that we are screwed up. Then. Now. All the time in between and, it’s a safe bet to assume, the rest of the time we’re alive. But we will pay $400 to go hear a “Bible teacher” tell us how we are only a few verses, prayers and cds away from being a lot better. And we will set quietly, or applaud loudly, when the story is retold. I’m really better now. I’m a good Christian. I’m not a mess anymore. I’m different from other people.
Wednesday, April 08, 2009
Oh My!
Imonk is at it again.
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6 comments:
Bob, I'm interested in your thoughts.
I read iMonk, find him helpful, and personally like him. But I've wondered - is there a happy medium between fake, everything-together Christianity and I'm-so-screwed-up Christianity?
I won't call myself a "good" Christian, mainly because you guys use scare-quotes around that :-) - but I've long felt that becoming a Christian at 19 was a huge turn of events in my life, that set me on a trajectory for a much more happy, fulfilled life than I would have had.
Am I there? Have I arrived? Do I have no problems? Hoo-boy, there's no way I could say yes to any of those.
But Christ has made my life better. I've got miles and eons to go. We have many challenges, with our kids, with the future, and with living the life Christ wants us to live (in other words, maybe my life's good because I'm lazy and not doing what Jesus wants). But I simply can't complain - He has been good.
In other words, I'd be lying if I said I had it all together. But I'd also be lying if I said I was completely screwed up. I feel like I've been fixed, am being fixed, and will ultimately be completely fixed.
I really trust your opinion on that, and wanted to avoid bringing this up on iMonk's site since I don't think I'd be understood.
Can we discuss? Let me know - thanks!
When I read Imonk's words of a supposed "good Christians," [not so much scare-quotes as mocking-quotes], "I’m really better now. I’m a good Christian. I’m not a mess anymore. I’m different from other people," well, I know that's not me. Better than someone or something I would have been if I hadn't been saved? Well, yeah, I guess. But that's a hypothetical of little real importance. Better enough to be called good? Better enough to be considered somebody's model? Not on your life. I pretty much still feel like a dang mess.
Then there's the the sociological evidence, which indicates no difference in the likelihood of, say, depression, among those claiming to be Christians as compared to non Christians. If you trust the sociologists, then there's a lot of posing going on in the churches, which is really Imonk's point.
The truth is, Bill, on a good day I can totally relate to your point, and second it with loud huzzahs. Fixed, being fixes, and ultimately completely fixed. That's right. But by and large the first and last of this triad are experienced by faith alone, and the middle piece of experienced in the bloody mess of brokenness. "Being fixed" is a little like surgery! Nothing to feel all warm and fuzzy about!
That's what I've got for now. You raise a great point, well worth hammering out. One thing I know is, the hammerin' ain't done!
Thanks Bob,
I think I get what you are saying. My issue is that I believe the Gospel is supposed to make us better. Paul (who wasn't averse to decrying his own failings) wrote " . . . that you may be blameless and innocent, children of God without blemish in the midst of a crooked and twisted generation, among whom you shine as lights in the world"
That's what's supposed to be happening. My concern is that we're taking it from the Chestertonian "the Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting, but it's been found to be too hard and left untried" (a bit paraphrased) and instead it's morphing into "Jesus won't fix you and in fact will make you even more of a mess and more miserable than you are now".
I don't believe that's iMonk's point, or yours. But I hear its echoes. I felt the same way about the Wild at Heart formula of "Every man has a father wound". Lots do. But not every man.
Part of the way we feel may be due to the fact that we know how much further we have to go. Lots of non-Christians think they are just fine. We know the Ideal (and our true destination), and it is perfection. But I'm beginning to wonder what's wrong with me. The standard appears to be shifting from just recognizing our fallenness and accepting gratefully the grace and light God gives us, and instead is turning into a near-repudiation of sanctification. It's almost as if we're saying Jesus doesn't help at all. I'm having a disconnect between that and "let your light so shine before men"
I'm writing a lot here . . . :-) thanks for bearing with. I hope I'm not making you mad. Maybe I'm deceived. I probably have an over-developed sense of my own well-being.
I weep with you over the statistics about the church. I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that the church and The Church are different.
Thanks for the conversation. Rebuttal, rebuke, etc. is welcome.
No, I do think you're making a good point. I do think it should be noted that I'm not all down on myself, filled with self-contempt because I'm a no good rotten sinner (and probably neither is the Imonk). My desire is to live in a way that measures up to Christ, and every time I stop to measure my performance, well, I find I'm falling woefully short. It's the measuring that gets a lot of Christians down. Whenever I try to measure, if it doesn't come out disappointing, I'm probably kidding myself, weighing with biased scales! What a dilemma, then. "Oh who will save me from this always measuring and never measuring up." And the answer comes, "Thanks be to Christ, who has measured up in my place."
Is that a cop-out? I don't think so. The pressure to be Christlike is totally off, even as I pray, "Jesus, make me more like you today." In truth I'm not counting up my sins and wailing over them, nor am I counting up my progress in Christlikeness and giving myself a big hug! The one piece of measuring that counted for anything has already been done -- on the cross. What joy to reap that totally undeserved benefit!
Jesus said "be holy as I am holy."
Now why would He set us up to fail? He didn't! He sent the Holy Spirit to empower us... the same Spirit that raised Him from the dead and empowered HIM to live perfectly. You can live WITHOUT sinning. I'm sick and tired of the church saying we can't. I've realized recently that I've actually been able to at times go an entire day without sinning. That is by the grace of God alone!!!!
We teach grace as an excuse to be okay with sinning when in fact it is the very power sent from God Himself to keep us FROM sinning!
He is coming for a spotless bride and until we stop putting up with heresy that says we will never get this right, we will NOT be that bride!
Enough already! BE HOLY!!!!!!
I think that no amount of days without sinning will make me the spotless bride. Jesus made me spotless before I ever had such a day (not that I ever have!).
You know what? I'll take it. Grace as an excuse? I don't agree. Grace as a foundation. That's what I say. And with such a foundation, we will move on from one degree of holiness to another, longing for the day when "degrees" are a thing of the past, and the renovation project is complete!
Anyway, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree here. I respect you for the strength of your conviction and your ability to express those convictions well. I'm sorry if by reading this you've had to "put up with heresy."
Seems we all have to put up with things in this life . . . peace.
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